Post by Croc on Nov 5, 2006 20:59:36 GMT
This is a tale that may leave you absolutely speechless - so here goes...
The League of Ireland and the Football Association of Ireland have hit a new low - even for them.
Basically - three games in the League of Ireland were found to have been played with a suspended player participating for one of the sides in question per game.
Two of the three games were: Derry City - Bohemians (in which Sean Hargan of Derry was the suspended player who played) and Shamrock Rovers - Dundalk
The third match was Bohemians - Shelbourne, which Bohemians won 2-1, with Bohemians defender Jason McGuinness being the suspended player.
Now - Shelbourne are challenging for the title with Derry - and with it a tidy sum of prize money and Champions League qualification.
League rules state that the punishment for this is deduction of any points gained by the team in question in the game in question - which was implemented by the League at the time. Simple enough, yes?
Well - read on - be warned - the following features scenes of bafflement, half-arsed decisions and a club which runs the League rather than the FA running the league:...
Honest to god, the hypocrisy of Ollie Byrne knows no limits.
In the registration season, Pats begged for it to be extended on account of our fixture congestion. Ollie was adamant that it should finish on the scheduled date and naturally enough, the League backed him up. As a result, we ended up playing 5 games in 13 days.
Now he wants the season extended to avoid Shels having fixture congestion. Didn't notice him asking for it to be extended cos of Derry's fixture congestion - in the interests of fair play.
So - views, incredulity,
-ness?
The League of Ireland and the Football Association of Ireland have hit a new low - even for them.
Basically - three games in the League of Ireland were found to have been played with a suspended player participating for one of the sides in question per game.
Two of the three games were: Derry City - Bohemians (in which Sean Hargan of Derry was the suspended player who played) and Shamrock Rovers - Dundalk
The third match was Bohemians - Shelbourne, which Bohemians won 2-1, with Bohemians defender Jason McGuinness being the suspended player.
Now - Shelbourne are challenging for the title with Derry - and with it a tidy sum of prize money and Champions League qualification.
League rules state that the punishment for this is deduction of any points gained by the team in question in the game in question - which was implemented by the League at the time. Simple enough, yes?
Well - read on - be warned - the following features scenes of bafflement, half-arsed decisions and a club which runs the League rather than the FA running the league:...
League facing meltdown as Shels fight their corner
THE FAI appeals board is today expected to rule on the controversial Jason McGuinness case, but the off-field drama that is overshadowing this season's eircom League will not end there - even if a verdict is reached on that matter.
That's because Shelbourne chief executive Ollie Byrne has written to both the League and the FAI to express his concern over the handling of two other matters earlier in the season.
They relate to Derry City defender Sean Hargan playing in a game when he was suspended and the decision to wipe Dublin City's games from the record after they folded mid-season.
Byrne is promising "serious ramifications" unless the cause for his ire is taken seriously on this occasion.
Put simply, any hope that the pronouncement on the McGuinness saga will bring closure to off the field shenanigans overshadowing the title race is way offside.
Suspended
The McGuinness case relates to the Bohemians' defender playing while suspended in the Gypsies' 2-1 League win over Shelbourne back in August.
While Bohs claim they weren't aware that McGuinness was suspended, and blame the League for this fact, they had got confirmation TWICE by phone from the FAI that McGuinness was ok to play in the match, Shels appealed the decision to simply deduct three points from Bohs when UEFA precedents would suggest that, in such an instance, the opposition should be awarded a 3-0 victory.
And, even if Shels get the three points today, they will persist with their grievances relating to the other two affairs that were previously dealt with by the League.
While Byrne believes that Shels manager Pat Fenlon and his squad are "the best team in the League" that can finish the job on the pitch anyway, he has a Plan B ready just in case that Derry prove stronger in the league climax.
With just over two fixture-congested weeks to go, Shels lead by three points but their opponents have a game in hand.
Byrne's quibble is not quite with the way Derry have conducted their business; his argument is that the League acted beyond their remit in both instances.
Hargan most definitely played in a League game against Bray when he should have been banned after picking up four yellow cards.
However, with the League's board of control handling the issue of points deductions, Derry were allowed to present a case prior to any sanction being handed out and the Candystripes avoided penalty when they uncovered the fact that the FAI disciplinary commission had considered Hargan's case a week earlier than they should have.
Byrne insists that the League did not have authority to consider Derry's argument at that stage when it was clear that Hargan was definitely suspended. And the Shels supremo is resolute that Derry should have accepted a points deduction initially and then pursued the FAI appeals board avenue, where they could have pleaded their innocence.
The argument against the decision to expunge Dublin City's games from the record is based along similar lines. Byrne's grounds for questioning the final verdict - which was made by the eircom League's management committee - is that it wasn't their decision to make.
By erasing the deceased Vikings' games in this campaign, Derry gained three points on Shels as they lost one of their games against the ill fated club.
Confused? Join the club.
"This is not sour grapes," said Byrne in defence of his actions in taking the matter further. "All I ask is that the goalposts aren't moved and that the playing field remains the same for everybody."
While the Shelbourne chief's concerns are nothing new to the League - they discussed some of the issues at a board of control meeting last month after receiving an earlier letter - the powers-that-be are still bracing themselves for whatever course of action that Shelbourne choose to take.
However - it now transpires that clubs involved in two other matches in the League in which suspended players featured will not be entertained with being replayed - points deductions in these cases will stand.
It's hard to see a happy conclusion to this one no matter what happens from here.
THE FAI appeals board is today expected to rule on the controversial Jason McGuinness case, but the off-field drama that is overshadowing this season's eircom League will not end there - even if a verdict is reached on that matter.
That's because Shelbourne chief executive Ollie Byrne has written to both the League and the FAI to express his concern over the handling of two other matters earlier in the season.
They relate to Derry City defender Sean Hargan playing in a game when he was suspended and the decision to wipe Dublin City's games from the record after they folded mid-season.
Byrne is promising "serious ramifications" unless the cause for his ire is taken seriously on this occasion.
Put simply, any hope that the pronouncement on the McGuinness saga will bring closure to off the field shenanigans overshadowing the title race is way offside.
Suspended
The McGuinness case relates to the Bohemians' defender playing while suspended in the Gypsies' 2-1 League win over Shelbourne back in August.
While Bohs claim they weren't aware that McGuinness was suspended, and blame the League for this fact, they had got confirmation TWICE by phone from the FAI that McGuinness was ok to play in the match, Shels appealed the decision to simply deduct three points from Bohs when UEFA precedents would suggest that, in such an instance, the opposition should be awarded a 3-0 victory.
And, even if Shels get the three points today, they will persist with their grievances relating to the other two affairs that were previously dealt with by the League.
While Byrne believes that Shels manager Pat Fenlon and his squad are "the best team in the League" that can finish the job on the pitch anyway, he has a Plan B ready just in case that Derry prove stronger in the league climax.
With just over two fixture-congested weeks to go, Shels lead by three points but their opponents have a game in hand.
Byrne's quibble is not quite with the way Derry have conducted their business; his argument is that the League acted beyond their remit in both instances.
Hargan most definitely played in a League game against Bray when he should have been banned after picking up four yellow cards.
However, with the League's board of control handling the issue of points deductions, Derry were allowed to present a case prior to any sanction being handed out and the Candystripes avoided penalty when they uncovered the fact that the FAI disciplinary commission had considered Hargan's case a week earlier than they should have.
Byrne insists that the League did not have authority to consider Derry's argument at that stage when it was clear that Hargan was definitely suspended. And the Shels supremo is resolute that Derry should have accepted a points deduction initially and then pursued the FAI appeals board avenue, where they could have pleaded their innocence.
The argument against the decision to expunge Dublin City's games from the record is based along similar lines. Byrne's grounds for questioning the final verdict - which was made by the eircom League's management committee - is that it wasn't their decision to make.
By erasing the deceased Vikings' games in this campaign, Derry gained three points on Shels as they lost one of their games against the ill fated club.
Confused? Join the club.
"This is not sour grapes," said Byrne in defence of his actions in taking the matter further. "All I ask is that the goalposts aren't moved and that the playing field remains the same for everybody."
While the Shelbourne chief's concerns are nothing new to the League - they discussed some of the issues at a board of control meeting last month after receiving an earlier letter - the powers-that-be are still bracing themselves for whatever course of action that Shelbourne choose to take.
However - it now transpires that clubs involved in two other matches in the League in which suspended players featured will not be entertained with being replayed - points deductions in these cases will stand.
It's hard to see a happy conclusion to this one no matter what happens from here.
Anarchy reigns as legal eagles get ready to make move
Thursday November 2nd 2006
THE confusion that is rapidly enveloping this season's eircom League took another remarkable twist yesterday when an FAI appeals board ordered that Bohemians and Shelbourne should replay August's controversial clash at Dalymount Park .
It was expected that, in considering the case of the game which Bohemians won 2-1 while fielding the suspended Jason McGuinness, the independently chaired FAI body would either uphold the League's decision to deduct Bohs three points or use UEFA precedents and award Shelbourne a 3-0 victory from the fixture.
Instead, the completely unprecedented verdict to replay the match "in the interests of fair play" has caused acrimony, with Shelbourne the only party that seems content with the verdict.
Rather than being three points ahead of Derry with a game more played in the title race, Shels now retain that advantage with the same amount of matches remaining.
And they also have the opportunity to get another shot at defeating a Bohs team which will be considerably weaker than that which secured the win in the original match - a fact that hasn't gone unnoticed on Foyleside.
However, it's still not certain that the match will be played - there is huge opposition to yesterday's decision as well as uncertainty over when it can be fitted into the calendar - and there is now a very real prospect of the League falling into complete disarray.
Arbitration
The FAI ruling says that the Bohs-Shels match should be "replayed as a matter of urgency" but it concedes that the option of further arbitration is available - a route that Bohemians or the League may decide to pursue.
Derry City refused to comment yesterday but it's understood that their legal advisors will monitor the situation while events play themselves out over the next couple of days.
The League's board of control will hold an emergency meeting tomorrow, but sources consider it highly unlikely that they will challenge the FAI's decision.
Bohemians, who are also planning to seek legal advice, won't make any decision on their stance until after the outcome of the League's meeting is announced.
Arranging another game against their fierce Dublin rivals at short notice would be a big undertaking, given the security concerns that arise from such a fixture.
As things stands, Shels are due to face Drogheda tomorrow before travelling to Sligo next Tuesday and Cork the following Friday.
Ironically, their final game is against Bohemians at Tolka Park on November 17.
Logically, it seemed that the only solution was to arrange another meeting with Bohs for Monday November 13 - the same night that Derry are in Waterford.
However, to add further intrigue to the situation, FAI sources last night confirmed that the fixture will not be allowed to take place at Dalymount on that date because Ireland are due to play a 'B' international against Scotland there on the following night.
Shels chief executive Ollie Byrne initially favoured rearranging their game against Sligo and playing the refixed match with Bohs next Tuesday. However, that is out of the question considering that Bohs will wait until Monday before deciding if they are going to accept the FAI appeals board ruling.
Overall, the Shels supremo was satisfied with the outcome of the FAI's deliberations.
"It's not the ideal result in accordance with the rules but we are reasonably happy because we didn't want to win games in Merrion Square because of inadvertent mistakes," he said.
Eircom League clubs up and down the country are now wondering if a precedent has now been set and if future disputes can be settled by replays in the name of 'fair play.'
"It's something you would expect in junior football," said one club official yesterday.
"But in this case there's a lot of money and other implications involved."
Either way, it seems that a verdict which was supposed to provide a semblance of closure has provided more questions than answers. This will drag on and on.
Thursday November 2nd 2006
THE confusion that is rapidly enveloping this season's eircom League took another remarkable twist yesterday when an FAI appeals board ordered that Bohemians and Shelbourne should replay August's controversial clash at Dalymount Park .
It was expected that, in considering the case of the game which Bohemians won 2-1 while fielding the suspended Jason McGuinness, the independently chaired FAI body would either uphold the League's decision to deduct Bohs three points or use UEFA precedents and award Shelbourne a 3-0 victory from the fixture.
Instead, the completely unprecedented verdict to replay the match "in the interests of fair play" has caused acrimony, with Shelbourne the only party that seems content with the verdict.
Rather than being three points ahead of Derry with a game more played in the title race, Shels now retain that advantage with the same amount of matches remaining.
And they also have the opportunity to get another shot at defeating a Bohs team which will be considerably weaker than that which secured the win in the original match - a fact that hasn't gone unnoticed on Foyleside.
However, it's still not certain that the match will be played - there is huge opposition to yesterday's decision as well as uncertainty over when it can be fitted into the calendar - and there is now a very real prospect of the League falling into complete disarray.
Arbitration
The FAI ruling says that the Bohs-Shels match should be "replayed as a matter of urgency" but it concedes that the option of further arbitration is available - a route that Bohemians or the League may decide to pursue.
Derry City refused to comment yesterday but it's understood that their legal advisors will monitor the situation while events play themselves out over the next couple of days.
The League's board of control will hold an emergency meeting tomorrow, but sources consider it highly unlikely that they will challenge the FAI's decision.
Bohemians, who are also planning to seek legal advice, won't make any decision on their stance until after the outcome of the League's meeting is announced.
Arranging another game against their fierce Dublin rivals at short notice would be a big undertaking, given the security concerns that arise from such a fixture.
As things stands, Shels are due to face Drogheda tomorrow before travelling to Sligo next Tuesday and Cork the following Friday.
Ironically, their final game is against Bohemians at Tolka Park on November 17.
Logically, it seemed that the only solution was to arrange another meeting with Bohs for Monday November 13 - the same night that Derry are in Waterford.
However, to add further intrigue to the situation, FAI sources last night confirmed that the fixture will not be allowed to take place at Dalymount on that date because Ireland are due to play a 'B' international against Scotland there on the following night.
Shels chief executive Ollie Byrne initially favoured rearranging their game against Sligo and playing the refixed match with Bohs next Tuesday. However, that is out of the question considering that Bohs will wait until Monday before deciding if they are going to accept the FAI appeals board ruling.
Overall, the Shels supremo was satisfied with the outcome of the FAI's deliberations.
"It's not the ideal result in accordance with the rules but we are reasonably happy because we didn't want to win games in Merrion Square because of inadvertent mistakes," he said.
Eircom League clubs up and down the country are now wondering if a precedent has now been set and if future disputes can be settled by replays in the name of 'fair play.'
"It's something you would expect in junior football," said one club official yesterday.
"But in this case there's a lot of money and other implications involved."
Either way, it seems that a verdict which was supposed to provide a semblance of closure has provided more questions than answers. This will drag on and on.
Appeals Board ruling – what’s going on?
November 2, 2006
Bohemians, deducted three points for fielding an ineligible player against Shelbourne in August, can effectively erase that penalty by winning the replayed fixture following the decision of the FAI Appeals Board to replay the game, while the destination of the eircom League crown looks set to be decided in the courts. eleven-a-side.com wonders how any of this can make sense?
The Appeals Board, which announced its decisions on Wednesday, has upheld the initial decision to deduct three points from Bohs for fielding a suspended player – Jason McGuinness – in their victory over Shelbourne on August 17th. But it could yet transpire that Bohs will regain those points via the replayed fixture against Shels, which should, according to the appeals body, be replayed as a matter of urgency. We would then, in the event of another Bohs win, have a situation whereby a footnote to the Premier Division table would state that Bohemians were deducted three points – yet they would still have the same points total as if the penalty had never been imposed.
Ridiculous. But as farcical as all that may be, the real issue here is the chance afforded to Shelbourne to collect another three points, which effectively cancels out Derry City’s game in hand on the Premier Division leaders going into the last fortnight of the season. So, for the second time in five years, the destination of the League of Ireland crown will be settled off the field. It looks unavoidable, following the bizarre decision that the Bohs-Shels fixture should be replayed “in the interests of Fair Play”.
Five years ago, the Marney/Mbabazi affair, which exposed the league’s player registration procedures as a farce, resulted in St Patrick’s Athletic being deducted 15 points and Shelbourne lifting a tarnished championship.
If no agreement can be reached within the next few days, a similar scenario looks set to transpire this time around. At the heart of the current debacle is the eircom League rulebook, which appears at odds with normal practices under Fifa and Uefa regulations. Under league rules, the fielding of an ineligible player is punished by the deduction of any points at stake in the game, or games, in which the ineligible player took part. Already this season, First Division side Shamrock Rovers have been docked three points for fielding Paul Shiels against Dundalk when the midfielder should have been serving a ban.
In the Premier Division, Derry escaped a similar punishment, successfully arguing that they had not been notified that defender Sean Hargan should have been serving a suspension when he played against Bohemians in July. The dreaded asterisk, signifying a points deduction, has been an almost ever-present feature of eircom League tables in recent years. But there is ambiguity, and double-standards at play.
In September 2001, Shelbourne and Derry both appealed that a decision not to deduct St Patrick’s Athletic nine points for three games in which Paul Marney played without being properly registered. On that occasion, the clubs claimed that the rulebook was unequivocal – that any club fielding an ineligible player be docked three points for every game in which that player featured. Now, however, a different argument has been put forward – that Shels, because they lost the game in which Bohemians’ Jason McGuinness played when he should have been serving a suspension, should instead be awarded three points.
November 2, 2006
Bohemians, deducted three points for fielding an ineligible player against Shelbourne in August, can effectively erase that penalty by winning the replayed fixture following the decision of the FAI Appeals Board to replay the game, while the destination of the eircom League crown looks set to be decided in the courts. eleven-a-side.com wonders how any of this can make sense?
The Appeals Board, which announced its decisions on Wednesday, has upheld the initial decision to deduct three points from Bohs for fielding a suspended player – Jason McGuinness – in their victory over Shelbourne on August 17th. But it could yet transpire that Bohs will regain those points via the replayed fixture against Shels, which should, according to the appeals body, be replayed as a matter of urgency. We would then, in the event of another Bohs win, have a situation whereby a footnote to the Premier Division table would state that Bohemians were deducted three points – yet they would still have the same points total as if the penalty had never been imposed.
Ridiculous. But as farcical as all that may be, the real issue here is the chance afforded to Shelbourne to collect another three points, which effectively cancels out Derry City’s game in hand on the Premier Division leaders going into the last fortnight of the season. So, for the second time in five years, the destination of the League of Ireland crown will be settled off the field. It looks unavoidable, following the bizarre decision that the Bohs-Shels fixture should be replayed “in the interests of Fair Play”.
Five years ago, the Marney/Mbabazi affair, which exposed the league’s player registration procedures as a farce, resulted in St Patrick’s Athletic being deducted 15 points and Shelbourne lifting a tarnished championship.
If no agreement can be reached within the next few days, a similar scenario looks set to transpire this time around. At the heart of the current debacle is the eircom League rulebook, which appears at odds with normal practices under Fifa and Uefa regulations. Under league rules, the fielding of an ineligible player is punished by the deduction of any points at stake in the game, or games, in which the ineligible player took part. Already this season, First Division side Shamrock Rovers have been docked three points for fielding Paul Shiels against Dundalk when the midfielder should have been serving a ban.
In the Premier Division, Derry escaped a similar punishment, successfully arguing that they had not been notified that defender Sean Hargan should have been serving a suspension when he played against Bohemians in July. The dreaded asterisk, signifying a points deduction, has been an almost ever-present feature of eircom League tables in recent years. But there is ambiguity, and double-standards at play.
In September 2001, Shelbourne and Derry both appealed that a decision not to deduct St Patrick’s Athletic nine points for three games in which Paul Marney played without being properly registered. On that occasion, the clubs claimed that the rulebook was unequivocal – that any club fielding an ineligible player be docked three points for every game in which that player featured. Now, however, a different argument has been put forward – that Shels, because they lost the game in which Bohemians’ Jason McGuinness played when he should have been serving a suspension, should instead be awarded three points.
Todays Irish Mail.
The Eircom League descended further into chaos last night as it emerged that Shelbourne may seek an injunction to suspend the Premier Division until the current controversy over the Jason McGuinness issue is resolved.
"Fixture congestion may now severly hamper league leaders Shels' title prospects" , says Shelbourne CEO Oliver Byrne.
"There are approximately 14 days until the end of the season and I do not believe any matches should take place until the issue is resolved as it is putting Shelbourne at a total disadvantage, added Byrne."
The Eircom League descended further into chaos last night as it emerged that Shelbourne may seek an injunction to suspend the Premier Division until the current controversy over the Jason McGuinness issue is resolved.
"Fixture congestion may now severly hamper league leaders Shels' title prospects" , says Shelbourne CEO Oliver Byrne.
"There are approximately 14 days until the end of the season and I do not believe any matches should take place until the issue is resolved as it is putting Shelbourne at a total disadvantage, added Byrne."
Honest to god, the hypocrisy of Ollie Byrne knows no limits.
In the registration season, Pats begged for it to be extended on account of our fixture congestion. Ollie was adamant that it should finish on the scheduled date and naturally enough, the League backed him up. As a result, we ended up playing 5 games in 13 days.
Now he wants the season extended to avoid Shels having fixture congestion. Didn't notice him asking for it to be extended cos of Derry's fixture congestion - in the interests of fair play.
So - views, incredulity,
-ness?
